Wrist pin noise.....will it hurt to drive the car

18693 Views 19 Replies 10 Participants Last post by Moose4555, Feb 3, 2022

Nasty Wendy

Discussion Starter · Jun 2, 2003

I'm still fighting this dang noise in my motor. I have changed the rod bearings...the crank is still smooth but I did have some premature bearing wear. I guess that coolant that got into the oil did do some damage to the bearings. The engine has quieted down greatly since I 1-set my lifter preload and 2-installed the new rod bearings, but I still can hear something. I'm thinking it might be a wrist pin...I'll pull plug wires and see if it stops. ANYWAY my question is will I hurt the motor by running it if there is a wristpin making this noise? My father who is a good SBC mechanic says that cars can go 100k miles with this problem but he doesn't know what effect adding boost to this problem would cause. The noise isn't bad and it mostly on deceleration although there is a spot in the rpm band at about 2500rpm that you can hear it if you hold it there. Thanks in advance for your time guys. powersix

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Turbo_Tim

· #2 · Jun 3, 2003

I've read somewhere about someone suspecting a wrist pin, and the symptoms were the same. The noise on de-celeration, and prominent at 2500 RPM.

Take a long 3/8" extension and place it on top the cam sensor and hold the extension to your ear. If you can here a dink dink dink sound through it, there is play in the sensor and the drive.

Stethascope might help...

Could be rocker arm components cracked?

How about the timng tensioner/ loose chain..?

Bad lifter?

I've heard of wrist pins installed without the retainers. I've also heard engine builders poo-poo this like it's no big deal...

I've also heard of ruining a block that way....

Sorry to hear of this. Hope you locate the problem.

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ULYCYC

· #3 · Jun 3, 2003

I would suspect that your mystery cam is your problem. I bet with that strange split grind it has a fast ramp and making it sound like a sewing machine. At this point with knock problems you can't enjoy the car. Pull the motor and do a full inspection.

Orlando_87GN

· #4 · Jun 3, 2003

You have the very rare crank knock

Seriously though, didn't you say you could isolate the noise to a certain cylinder by unplugging a wire or injector? This would leave me to believe it's not the cam.

I know you said you r&r all the rod bearings, but that's not going to help an out-of-round condition.

What did the pan look like? Any metal? What did the bearings look like? See any of that copper color? powersix

Nasty Wendy

Discussion Starter · #5 · Jun 4, 2003

Turbo Tim a camsensor causing this problem would be just the break I need. I have another complete camsensor I could try. Thanks for the chime in...I didn't know they could do that. I put a double roller chain on less that 20K ago with no tensioner. I asked about lifters do this before....but its not that ticking noise that lifters are known for. Its not a rocker arm or shaft...I've tried two sets of them. Thanks

Ed I called Schnieder Racing and they told me that they make the grind that I have for Eastern Performance. I haven't talked to anyone at Eastern yet..I'll do a search for their number. The man at Schnieder told me that one of the good things about his cams are how quiet they are. I do have a motor going on its way for a rebuild tomorrow....I just want to drive the car instead of letting it sit until the rebuild is complete and installed. Thanks

Orlando Jones CRANK KNOCK..are you trying to get me to GIVE the car away eek! ? Isolating the noise by pulling the plug wires is what I did to find out the #1 cylinder was making the racket. I changed the Rod bearings because of that. All but one of the bearings were showing are starting to show copper. The #1 Bearing was the worst followed by the #5. The new bearings have all but killed the noise. What I can hear now is very faint but prevailent. I was figuring that the old bearings where increasing this noise by increased clearances. There were a few shavings and grainules of metal in the pan....couldn't that come from breaking in the motor? I took a day off from working on the car and I will do the pull-the-plugwire test again to see if the noise is still coming from one cylinder. Thanks

I hate to question the caliber of the Mechanic that did the rebuilds but I'm just about out of places to point the finger. I really would be over joyed to find its the cam sensor.
Thanks guys, if it weren't for you I wouldn't know everything!!! wink

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Turbocars

· #6 · Jun 4, 2003

The cam sensor suggestion caught my attention cuz mine is noisy when cold but the ticking goes away when warmed up. I compared to another CS and they felt the same regarding shaft play with the cap off. Althou there is play. Is there a remedy or not to worry?

Turbo_Tim

· #7 · Jun 4, 2003

I was told once you could 'shim' it. I don't pretend to know what that means tho...

Maybe raise the unit a bit to to get on to a different height on the gear?

<small>[ June 04, 2003, 06:46 PM: Message edited by: Turbo_Tim ]</small>

Steve Wood

· #8 · Jun 4, 2003

Means you pull it out, remove the drive gear, slip shims over the shaft until the shaft play is within tolerance, install the gear and put it back in the engine.

I posted the GM number for the shims a couple of days ago, but, chevy distributor shims work as well.

Maytag

· #9 · Jun 5, 2003

Check the shim to see if it has lost it's tension...If you decide to re-shim I would think twice before using the stock style spring steel wave washer. Had a few break before. Between .003 and .009 are suggested endplay I believe...STP

TTA89

· #10 · Jun 5, 2003

Nasty Wendy:
Turbo Tim a camsensor causing this problem would be just the break I need. I have another complete camsensor I could try. Thanks for the chime in...I didn't know they could do that. I put a double roller chain on less that 20K ago with no tensioner.

Not that this is the problem but just sharing my experience. Three of us purchased Rollmaster Double Roller chains. They were installed on 3 different cars. All low-mid 11 cars with bone stock long blocks except the chains. All cars ran great with no knock. After the chains all 3 cars had false knock, mostly at the top of the gears as much as 20 degrees sometimes.

My motor was taken apart to be rebuilt and one of the other cars was sold. The last car had a stock plastic timing chain with tensioner put back in it and all the false knock went away.

I have had people say no way it was the chains yet I saw it on 3 cars with no other changes but the stupid Rolldisasters and then one put back to a new GM stock chain and it was fine?

Hmmmm....................

Nasty Wendy

Discussion Starter · #11 · Jun 5, 2003

Thats interesting TTA89. Did the cars make the noise I've described too? Could you hear any noise caused by the chains at all if so what did it sound like? Thanks.

Turbocars

· #12 · Jun 5, 2003

Thanks for the 'ticking cam sensor' suggestions. The one I compared the 'ticker' to is probably out of tolerance also!

Steve: I'll do an archive search to locate those shim PNs........thanks.

Hank

ULYCYC

· #13 · Jun 5, 2003

Nasty Wendy:
Thats interesting TTA89. Did the cars make the noise I've described too? Could you hear any noise caused by the chains at all if so what did it sound like? Thanks.

""CLANK CLANK" "CLANK CLANK" "CLANK CLANK"

Nasty Wendy

Discussion Starter · #14 · Jun 5, 2003

Ahh you have had one of these too I see.

dunno

Steve Wood

· #15 · Jun 5, 2003

A very fast slap-more a ripple sound

here are the shim numbers again

yep...I went to the mailing list and found this written by Zak Klein who used to run the part department of Klein Buick who used to give us great prices....don't know if the numbers is still valid or not.

The part numbers for the cam sensor shims are:

1927529 = .005"
1837617 = .031"
* each kit contains 10 shims.

According to the May/June 1995 issue of the GS-Xtra, the desired
cam sensor drive gear to cam sensor housing clearance is .015"-.018",
by shimming to the proper specs the cam sensor noise can be
eliminated.

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Turbo_Tim

· #16 · Jun 5, 2003

Dang Steve, with all you know about these cars you should be working on them for a living. (or for some extra cash...) Too bad you so damm far from God-Knows Where! headbang

<small>[ June 05, 2003, 05:38 PM: Message edited by: Turbo_Tim ]</small>

Steve Wood

· #17 · Jun 6, 2003

anyone can search the archives.

Economy is bad out here and there ain't many Buicks.

I hate working on them, too boot. At the moment I am looking at some potential businesses which might incorporate some car stuff.

REDS HOT AIR

· #18 · Jun 6, 2003

rollmaster knocking???

I have tried all kinds of chains and the only ones I have used that didnt slap were roll masters .

now I wont install anything but rollmaster

I have tried other brand double rollers and had alot of chain slap but never from a rollmaster

not calling bluff just I have different experiences with them

usually chain slap causes cam sensor knock

Steve Wood

· #19 · Jun 6, 2003

I have a stretched rollmaster still out in the shop I think. After 4000 miles it was loose as a Mississippi goose.

I have heard, however, that they are the least strechable from other sources. My opinion is it is a lot easier, safer, and cheaper to go with regular chains on the flat tappet cams that normally get installed.

Moose4555

· #20 · Feb 3, 2022

TTA89 said:
Not that this is the problem but just sharing my experience. Three of us purchased Rollmaster Double Roller chains. They were installed on 3 different cars. All low-mid 11 cars with bone stock long blocks except the chains. All cars ran great with no knock. After the chains all 3 cars had false knock, mostly at the top of the gears as much as 20 degrees sometimes.

My motor was taken apart to be rebuilt and one of the other cars was sold. The last car had a stock plastic timing chain with tensioner put back in it and all the false knock went away.

I have had people say no way it was the chains yet I saw it on 3 cars with no other changes but the stupid Rolldisasters and then one put back to a new GM stock chain and it was fine?

Hmmmm....................

I have a engine in my 1992 Chevy truck. It was all rebuilt with double roller and it has that same sound when cold. does not sound like a rod or wrist pin, I am thinking it’s the double roller chain.

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