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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
well i think i have finaly goten the bugs out but . im wondering if im giving up performance from to large of turbo.engine is 3.8 ported iron heads 224 224 cam M&A intake ,eastern FM, and i have a 3400 stahl no boost converter. turbo is a pt 72 4 bolt with .82 housing . this thing spools slow. do you think it makes any sence to down size. i still want solid 10 second performance. thanks
 

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I have a 70 and it was a little slow at the 3200-3400 level. I had my convertor loosened to 3700 and it is right now. For the 72 you would need more like 4k stall. That is a bunch for a stock block. I don't think you could use it to its full potential on a stock block. The 70 would be better I think. Is your 72 a P or Q trim? The P-trim is better for a street/strip car.
 

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I just saw the 4 bolt and .82 housing. That hurts a bunch there and if it is Q-trim I can see exactly why it would respond the way you say. The hot turbo for solid 10's or even a high nine is a three bolt 70 P-trim with any turbine housing on it.
 

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yep, a 66 to 70 would make a much better driver.

As Dr. Mud, said, your current turbo might work on a hot stage engine but it is way overkill for a stock block or mild stage. :)
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
my turbo is a p trim. looks like i need to find someone building a stage engine and do a swap for a smaller turbo.i whould like to keep 4 bolt so i can run my curent headers and down pipe. my turbo is in excellent condition and always run with filtered oil. thanks
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
what do you think about a 60 - 1 . i have a chance to pick one up but i have never known any one to have run one around here to ask how it worked. thanks
 

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The TE60 used a 60-1 wheel as I recall. If that is a three bolt turbo, I would assume it is a TE60?

With your cam, converter and heads, I would think you would be better suited with something between a 62 or a 63 for a street car. Might be a bit tight on the converter for a 66, but I am not sure.
 

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I just got a TA-49 installed and "WOW" I got it from Jays GN.

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
thanks steve. the turbo is a 4 bolt an they called it a 60- 1. if i can pick it up for a good price i might try it . i know there are a lot of 3 bolt turbos out there to chose from i just dont want to change my headers and downpipe if i dont have to. thanks
 

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The 4 bolt housing is not your problem! I was told some years ago that the 4 bolt housing flowed a little better than the 3. Don't know if this is true or not, but I am very happy with mine, a 4 bolt 45 and .81 housing with a 3500 non l/u. I beleive you should try to trade down or talk to John Craig about redoing it to a smaller size, usually he works with you and gives some sort of allowance on your parts.
 

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It might be on the small side a bit..but the 4 bolt housings flow better on the exhaust side. Probably make a good street turbo.

The only fly in the ointment, potentially, is the size of the cam. It ain't helping the low end, and the top end of the rpm range is probably stressing the crank. I think a lot of them have been used, tho. :)

Between the cam and the converter, the current turbo is going to take awhile to get going. The eastern IC is a bit small too.

A smaller turbo will certainly help a bit.
 

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I think the cam may be too big also, a local guy went from 212 to 224 and went back within a couple months, he complained about low end power. I have to disagree about the Eastern front mount. I have one and is not seemed to slow me down even with my nasty flowmasters. :)
 

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Why not change the cam first and try the combo like that? Ron Joseph ran an LT76 Turbo on his GN before the S2 engine was installed with a much smaller cam and it ran OK? I don't know what cam but either the Weber 206/206 or RA new 214/214 and an 6 pump PI TC. (even the 204/214 cam works well) Like Craig said too much cam for your engine! Buicks make more power with smaller cams because of the power band of the engine, less rpms! Just some thoughts from an old GOAT! Gene
 

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The eastern was obviously behind the Cotton, PTE, and V2, in the Source test. It was even back performancewise on a 12 second car. Hence my comment with regard to something with ported heads and a big cam. It just does not flow the air.

It is certainly better than an original unit....it is just the restriction in the above combo. :)
 

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I vaguely remember the source test. I want to say it wasn't very scientific. My question is about these IC tests are, how much flow do you need and how much pressure drop is good. Just like a radiator, if the water flows through it too fast it will not have a chance to exchange heat. I don't mind the thinking that my IC is not good or is too small, because those other Buicks that have the big IC's and similar combos, I've busted their ass every time. :)
 

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I think you are thinking of another test as the Source test was done by Bob Dick and was very scientific, for a change. :) Bob is a ME specializing in thermodynamics.

Four front mounts were tested and data logged.

The best when it comes to pressure drop was cotton's with a psi drop of 1.67 and the worse was the ESP with 4.10. A stock ic was 5.52 and a duttweiller neck was 3.62 while a V4 was 2.98.

Thermal performance was also logged and as it varies during the run, it is hard to cite.

From the graphs, the V2 and Cottons are the best for heat transfer.


I agree with you, however, most of the ic stuff is way overkill for the actual use. :) I have not seen miraculous differences on the street, or even the strip on normal cars.

The tests suggest that a big neck gives a lot of bang for the buck on a street car altho heat transfer is not so good.
 

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Steve Wood:
The best when it comes to pressure drop was cotton's with a psi drop of 1.67 and the worse was the ESP with 4.10. A stock ic was 5.52 and a duttweiller neck was 3.62 while a V4 was 2.98.
This is what I really wonder about. How bad is bad? Is 4.10 psi drop good or bad? Is 1.67 good or bad? wink
 

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Is your header made for a 4 bolt, or is there an adapter on there? You may be able to switch to a 3 bolt .63 turbine housing and get it to spool a little quicker. If that doesn't help, and you know the wastegate is sealing properly, then a smaller turbo or higher stall converter is in order.

Eric
 
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