Sad day for Kirban's

[corsair231]

Originally Posted by ULYCYC

Dennis may be crusty but he is not a crook. He has sent parts out before payment for years. He is one vendor you never here problems with. If there is a glitch or error on his website, why would you try and bust his balls over it? That not too classy. That make you more of a crook to watch out for.

What is he supposed to do? This was not a private deal but a retail business. The customer went to the vendor's site. The customer placed an order in good faith for a displayed price and agreed for the charge to be placed on his credit card. The vendor accepted the order. The day after the order was processed the vendor contacted the customer and informed him that there was an error in the price displayed on "his" website and asked if it was okay to charge the customer a new amount on his credit card. The customer asked the vendor to honor his posted price. The vendor declined, stating that he, "Was not in the business to lose money." The customer asked for a refund and stated his intent to take his business elsewhere.

It's not important if it was about $9 or $90. We were not on the phone with them. Sometimes attitudes come across in conversations that are not apparent in written words. Whatever the conversation was, one of our community has felt the need to share his experience with this vendor. That is his right. This does not make the customer a crook but it does raise questions about the vendor. How many of us have had a bad experience at a restaurant and told people about it. Who did you tell? Did you tell people that would never go to that restaurant or did you tell people that may go there. There is no difference here. What good would it do to tell a Mustang forum about a Buick vendor?

It is the vendor's responsibility to ensure the accuracy of their website just as it is the store owners responsibility to make sure the prices displayed on the shelf are correct. In this case the vendor, instead of accepting responsibility for the error on his website, basically told the customer to pay whatever price he gives you or he doesn't need his business. This is a business that is open to the public so it is depends not only on advertising but also on publicity for business. Good publicity, the business does good, bad publicity, the business suffers. The customer had dealings with the vendor that left a sour taste in his mouth. He is just doing his part about publicizing the business for the vendor.

Just because we have cars that are no longer being made and have to rely on specialty vendors does not mean that we should be extorted (Although we are. Just watch the price go up on something that GM just discontinued. Price gouging anyone?). If the cost of shipping was really such a big deal to Kirban then he should have at the least offered to meet halfway to satisfy the customer instead of being assanine and stating that he "Was not in the business to lose money". It seems that he may not be interested in the business of being in business. I am sure that there was some type of order confirmation screen. If there was a problem about the shipping posted on the website that they were aware of then that problem should have been addressed and corrected then, not a day later when the item should have shipped. If it was not a know problem then the price should have been honored and the customer thanked for bringing it to their attention so it could be corrected. No precedent, just good ethical business practice. Kirban chose not to honor his website. He asked for the negative publicity.

Bottom line, Although people are in business to make money there is some truth in that old saying, "The customer is always right." Rev. 3:11, I thank you for doing the right thing and advertising for this vendor. I will remember it when shopping in the future.

[nero]

Originally Posted by corsair231

What is he supposed to do? This was not a private deal but a retail business. The customer went to the vendor's site. The customer placed an order in good faith for a displayed price and agreed for the charge to be placed on his credit card. The vendor accepted the order. The day after the order was processed the vendor contacted the customer and informed him that there was an error in the price displayed on "his" website and asked if it was okay to charge the customer a new amount on his credit card. The customer asked the vendor to honor his posted price. The vendor declined, stating that he, "Was not in the business to lose money." The customer asked for a refund and stated his intent to take his business elsewhere.

It's not important if it was about $9 or $90. We were not on the phone with them. Sometimes attitudes come across in conversations that are not apparent in written words. Whatever the conversation was, one of our community has felt the need to share his experience with this vendor. That is his right. This does not make the customer a crook but it does raise questions about the vendor. How many of us have had a bad experience at a restaurant and told people about it. Who did you tell? Did you tell people that would never go to that restaurant or did you tell people that may go there. There is no difference here. What good would it do to tell a Mustang forum about a Buick vendor?

It is the vendor's responsibility to ensure the accuracy of their website just as it is the store owners responsibility to make sure the prices displayed on the shelf are correct. In this case the vendor, instead of accepting responsibility for the error on his website, basically told the customer to pay whatever price he gives you or he doesn't need his business. This is a business that is open to the public so it is depends not only on advertising but also on publicity for business. Good publicity, the business does good, bad publicity, the business suffers. The customer had dealings with the vendor that left a sour taste in his mouth. He is just doing his part about publicizing the business for the vendor.

Just because we have cars that are no longer being made and have to rely on specialty vendors does not mean that we should be extorted (Although we are. Just watch the price go up on something that GM just discontinued. Price gouging anyone?). If the cost of shipping was really such a big deal to Kirban then he should have at the least offered to meet halfway to satisfy the customer instead of being assanine and stating that he "Was not in the business to lose money". It seems that he may not be interested in the business of being in business. I am sure that there was some type of order confirmation screen. If there was a problem about the shipping posted on the website that they were aware of then that problem should have been addressed and corrected then, not a day later when the item should have shipped. If it was not a know problem then the price should have been honored and the customer thanked for bringing it to their attention so it could be corrected. No precedent, just good ethical business practice. Kirban chose not to honor his website. He asked for the negative publicity.

Bottom line, Although people are in business to make money there is some truth in that old saying, "The customer is always right." Rev. 3:11, I thank you for doing the right thing and advertising for this vendor. I will remember it when shopping in the future.

Cogent and well said. Thanks for that.

[gbsean]

The trouble with these types of posts is you only here one side of the story.Maybe what happened is true,but maybe somethings were left out...maybe 3:11 took an attitude...Dennis is a pretty resonable guy..a little overpriced at times, but resonable...he even opened up his basement on a Saturday to let me look thru his stuff. I have "heard" other stories,but as a private buisness he also has the right to refuse service to a customer..The website is still wrong...no matter where you ship it in the U.S. it is $12.90 so that has still not been fixed....there is also no discalimer stating that prices may be incorrect and subject to change..If there was no verbal confrontation..Dennis should have done the right thing and ate the shipping...We do it all the time..our Vendors set minimums so we will place more orders and they pay for shipping...Bottom line if the site finalized the transaction..then that should be the price paid...and maybe Dennis does not make such a great profit...

[turbofish38]

Yes there is always two sides to a story. I see most of the replies here are from customers and not vendors. Just take some time out and go to USPS.COM or FedEx.com UPS.com and see just how much the shipping would cost you TODAY. With the increase in fuel costs anybody and everybody in the shipping buisiness has adjusted thier rates accordingly. We all b*tch about the price of stamps but never a peep about the brand-X guys. Everybody has switched over to a space used rate system where as the old system was by weight. I only mention this because I was shocked the last time I threw some parts on eBay. I must have shipped out thousands of parts over the last 10 years so I pretty much knew what an item would cost to ship. I sold a grille which would normally cost me about $12 to ship to the other side of the country. USPS wanted $32 to ship that part. Even though it weighed 5 pounds it took,by their formula, up the same space as a 20 pound package hence the increase in price. I had to eat a couple of bucks and ship it by UPS. I dont blame any vendor for not wanting to eat the difference after what I experienced. It is a buisiness. And if you have to eat a couple of bucks on each transaction than it wont be long before you're out of buisiness. But than on the other hand DK should have known this in time to upgrade his shipping rates. You complainers all act like the vendors are making huge profits on the stuff they sell so there fore $9 aint nothing. I can tell you that most if not all of the Buick and GM vendors advertising here aint making the money hand over fist as you would imagine.There is little profit in TR parts as you can see from all of the China header threads. Lets all cut them some slack and be a little more understanding. After all we are Human. If you can say you live your life like a saint than you're a better man than I am.

Hows that phrase from the Star Trek movies go? The needs of the many out weigh the needs of a few? A shoddy vendor will disappear just by reputation. It will take more than one negative transaction to scare away somebody like DK or Mr.Weaver. At least we dont have some crappy rating system like eBay does other wise they(vendors) wouldn't have any way to gauge how well they are really doing their jobs. I know from fact that threads like these to get their attention.

[ULYCYC]

Eric covered most of what I was going to say. Bottom line is Dennis is not Summit or Jegs. He works out of his house and his wife give your ice tea if you pick up your own parts. I've seen vendors make many error over the years even in our favor. Should we count that as a gift or call them back? I just ordered a console for a 442 Wednesday from Brian Weavy. He told me the price and I said ship it. I don't know the shipping but once it gets here I will sent him a check. Dennis is the same way. He seen the shipping error and called you. Did you say AHH I got you and demand it for less so he makes squat. Sorry, Most don't work that way. If he shipped it and you seen it on your statement then I could understand. But he CALLED YOU FIRST BEFORE shipping. This gave you a chance to think about the order. It wasn't "bait and switch" or a scam it was on shipping and an error in it's program. This doesn't soul like something to poster all over the Buick community to smear a good vendor. Funny, speaking of restaurants, I went out to eat tonight and the table next to us said the wine was bitter so they gave them another bottle. They wanted the wine for free and cut the total check for 6 people in half. I guess this sound reasonable to you.

[broke1]

I think you should be ashamed of yourself for trying to beat a vendor out of $9.

Man TR guys are some CHEAP sob's.This thread is rediculuos....

[87GTA-turbo]

Just wondering if the original poster would have started a "Kirban is a great guy" post, if Kirban ate the shipping charge.....

When you recieve an email from a vendor stating "an error was made in calculating shipping, more funds will be required."
Then you know what the vendors policy is; no need to argue, just pay, down grade shipping or cancel the order.
This Walmart attitude people have doesnt wash with a small business, all stores that have printed circulars (Walmart too) have in the fine print "Not responsible for typographical errors." This should be kept in mind, accomodating a customer for charges is a courtesy not mandatory.

I see Kirbans point: that you ordered the, gee, I dont know....
Grand National Panda bear and wanted it in 2 days and then preceeded to exchange emails and calls for the next 3 days he probably surmised that the Grand National Panda bear wasnt needed ASAP.


At least he has prices on his site....What about the guys that have the "call for pricing"

Just curious I guessed you ordered the Grand National Panda bear but you never mentioned what part you were ordering?

[FlyinGN]

I agree with most..... Just suck it up. For Gods sake, $9 aint gonna break ya. If it does myabe you should not own TR

[1FASTV6]

Who cares!

[1FASTV6]

Originally Posted by rev. 3:11

Just got off the phone with Dennis Kirban himself! All I can say is he lost a customer for life.

I guess it is safe to say you will not be attending the reunion.

[6cess]

it all depends on the day.. Maybe DK got his overhead for the month? Ive had problems w a couple vendors on here that people rave about. When people ask me I warn them. People say theyre great but I didnt have a gd experience. People are going to do what they feel. It sucks we cant really turn to other vendors so for $9 i wouldnt burn bridges. Hey at lest he called you. I had a vendor fight me over fuel o rings... A damaged part was also sent to me. w the same order as it was also a wk late. so I just try to avoid them, but I know one day Im going to have to swallow my pride and use them. Good Luck and hopefully you dont get pissed when you see the shipping label comming from DK even though you ordered from another vendor (its been know to happen).

[rev. 3:11]

The purpose of my post was to relate a vendor's conduct, and to advise board members of potential problems.

FWIW, I was the one who notified Kirban's (please read the post before jumping to silly conclusions)Why in the world would I ever consider myself "fortunate" that a retailer would sell me something at a profit? (that is the very nature of a free-market) just as In fact the opposite is the norm; without customers, Kirban's, or anyone else, would not be in business.
But I have no need, nor reason, to defend my actions. In fact there is an adage in the service industry that the customer is always right.
Anyone can do business with any vendor they choose, I choose to do my future dealings with those I consider to have integrity and do not dismiss me out-of-hand and go on the defensive in an insulting manner over the phone when I point out a legitimate error.

87GTA-turbo: As for what I was purchasing, it is irrelavant, Your sophomoric attempt to denigrate me over the items I wish to purchase seems a bit defensive; if you are awestruck over the possibility that someone may get a Grand National Panda bear before you do, then you may have bigger issues than I do.

BTW the erroneous shipping price is still posted as of today (8/21/07).

Thank you all for taking time to post your comments!

D

[87GTA-turbo]

Originally Posted by rev. 3:11

As for what I was purchasing, it is irrelavant,

No its quite relavant, thats why I asked. There are some parts that are urgent like a brake accumulator, sensor etc..
And some parts that are BS like a GN panda Bear, hat, shirt, etc.
The fact that you omitted the part told me it was a frivolous purchase and you were being an unreasonable customer.

BTW you mentioned that you contacted him I re-read your first post it reads: "Got e-mail next dat stating they were doubling the shipping $$, and did I still want order?
I said yes, but at THEIR posted price. Went back & forth telling........"

[rev. 3:11]

Gentle Readers,
Many have chosen to intentionally miss the point. Again, this is why reading and comprehension are important. The conduct of a businessman toward his client is the heart of the matter; when I am told that I am not as important as a party that is being planned (supposedly for those same clients, maybe even me?!) then I will not bother him with something as tiresome as a purchase (if that's okay with you, 87GTA-turbo).

I fail to see why you are taking this so personally, and quite frankly, I am shocked that you would consider any of Kirban's parts to be "BS" or frivolous! (Although I agree, a brake accumulator would be frivolous; what person would dream of not upgrading their brake system?)!!! Shame on you... as to the part (s) I ordered... I'll never tell...

But seriously, the real point of the matter is integrity, the dignity to stand by your word, and treating your customer as if they mattered to you, no matter what. Do unto others as you would have them do unto you. That's the problem today, many do not see their word as their bond.

Bottom line: a price was posted and a higher amount was charged. Not MY fault. I simply asked to be charged what was agreed upon, and many want to make me out as a bad guy for daring to call him out on it.


(p.s. 87 GTA: it was a flux-capacitor)

Again, I would like to thank everyone for their input.

D

[87GTA-turbo]

Originally Posted by rev. 3:11

Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.

Ahh ...this is the key phrase what about FORGIVENESS, and UNDERSTANDING?
His site had an error, he admitted it, gave a choice; none of which were pleasing, you decided to show the world his "transgressions".

I feel it was cheap, petty, and over dramatic; when I saw the post "Sad day for Kirban's" I thought it was a tragic death or Injury...and then I see a post about a lousy $9!!!!

I'll be the first to admit I am not a huge fan of kirban his prices are a little high and so on, but he has been around a long time and has always been a pillar in the TR community; and should be for some time, (God willing).
I suspect by your screen name, and other comments you may possibly be a Christian but the conduct displayed has not been supporting evidence.

Sorry I dont see your point, but we shall agree to disagree.