fuel pump test lead

[chris j.]

been having a problem for a couple weeks now and have been working thru them with the help of this board, was working till yesterday. believe i already know but i want to double check before i go dropping the tank yet again. problem started... (signs of a slow death??) i would stop and turn gn off to get gas or a short amount of time and pump would not run, i had checked fuses and nothing wrong, was suggested that relays or something was getting hot and while i was cheking out fuses it had time to cool and operate correctly. sounded great and made sence. i replaced the relay under the hood( i was told by Mr.Wood to use the fuel pump test lead during this condition to see if pump would operate, but after replacing the relay it didn't do it again) but not the one in the hotwire kit. i probably should but i didn't know if my local parts place is bright enough to match it up with a new one, and i don't know how either, which leads to another question... i understand that if the relay up front is malfunctioning when the oil press switch sees something like 4 psi it will override and allow the pump to operate, with the hotwire kit in place and if the hotwire relay is bad, would that kill this idea?? ...back at the pump, the pig tail that comes from the car to the pump, what are they, which one should be hot and which is ground ? heres where i'm at now. yesterday morning car wouldn't start, no pump running what so ever. went out today with multi meter and test light, first thing i did was test light from positive batt. to FP test lead and nothing. just to be sure, i went to the back and pulled the hotwire plug and plugged it up the way it would be if the hotwire kit wasn't there, and still nothing. all fuses are good, the relays except the hotwire relay are new. i can see voltage back there but that is also why i asked which were supposed to be hot and the ground... just kinda in denial here, i guess. this if she is in fact dead, the 4th pump i have installed. the first was destroyed by a fuel tank coating i was told was the best way to go, and what a hard and costly way to learn that shop was full of BS, the coating failed and i had to get a new pump and clean the entire fuel system(lasted about 1 week before coating failed). the second was blamed on low voltage, that was his story and he stuck to it, thats when the hotwire kit was installed and voltage couldn't be the problem again!(second one lasted all of about 9-10 months) however they did swap my pump for a new one. the third, i just can't answer... it is sitting in a brand new fuel tank( no coating, its new!!!!) with a new hotwire kit and here i sit almost a year later thinking my pump has died again, i had even replaced the wiring going into the tank! the pump itself comes in a box marked "ENGINE WORKS", a private label thing i figured, i opened the box before i bought the first one(and of couse all the others!) and they are all stanmped with the "w" and all are marked by walbro, so i had no problem with it, maybe thats my problem, hell i don't know. i know the guy who runs this local speed shop and i got into it over the last one and he finally appologized even though he says he's never had a problem like this from any other pumps, so far this is the story of my GN, it eats antennas and pumps! just for the record, there is nothing stupid going on with my electrical system that i can see, i have even driving around with multi meters hooked up in various place to look for spikes, surges or shorts, nothing has shown up. i have had it to a mechanic friend of mine and he has gone thru the electric system twice, hooked up his laptops and all the sweet toys they have and he thinks its fine.
would you all agree i'm in denial here?!!!
thanks for reading a long thread and any input appreciated!
chris

[ES]

To check the pump at the tank, I disconnected the FP relay and added power from a extra battery I had.
Once I knew the pump ran, I hooked up the original relay and when the pump did not run, I checked
FP fuse
FP relay
ECM/Ign fuse
The ECM/Ign fuse was the one that was blown on mine.
Don't know if this helps but this was how I ran down my problem.

[Steve Wood]

I guess I cannot focus today...or most days

I got lost in all the words.

As stated before, the pump should only run for a couple of seconds when you flip the key on...that is the only time the fuel pump test lead will be hot.

Now, assuming....(big leap of faith) that the hot wire relay is good, if you apply 12 volts to the test lead, the pump should run continually.

I would start by bypassing the hot wire so it is wired like the factory and put 12 volts to the test lead. You can either plug it into the wire that goes to the underhood light, or, connect it to the back of the alternator where the wire to the battery connects.

Pump should run, does it?

If I did not provide any help, let me know, and I will go back and try to figure out what you were asking...after I have had a nap and am in a better focussing state

[chris j.]

steve, i hear ya, i appologize for the extensive post, i just didn't want to have everything scattered around or not enough info! not to mention the only thing that stopped me was the keyboard was getting hot!... as far as the test lead goes when the pump that failed because of the coating gave up, it was still working just crammed full of the coating, so i used the test lead like i had learned from you to drain the tank. this time however, no moatter what configuration i use i get no action at the pump, that is why i asked what should be hot and what shouldn't be at the back by the tank, i just couldn't remember whicha was what, hell i almost forgot i put wing nuts on the tank itself! kidding man!~ you would think after all this i would know this inside out but i just don't remember, i do remember that before the hotwire kit she was only seeing 10.9-11.1 volts at the pigtail in back and that is why i bought the reason for the other pump failure and then purchased the kit. it also taught me a lesson to listen to what you all had to say on here. i remember joining this board and everyone telling me to get a HW kit and a scan master. anyway keys are getting hot again!, think i need a nap!
in all seriousness, i have just moved again and i'm dealing with some ignorant bullshit and i haven't been the greatest member of this board but everytime i need help you guys are there and damn do i appreciate it tons! like i said i am just trying to lie myself into believing i don't have to push this thing out of the street and put the tank on the ground again. the private label thing i mentioned , does that sound strange to any one? imean damn! i work in auto paint and we private label some things too, but it in reality it is the same damn thing! thanks again for time and patience, i am almost out of hair. i love my GN and she is all i got and she is the only thing that hasn't screwed me over(kinda hard to say while i am bitching, but its not her fault, i do not believe, anyway!), but this thing has got to stop! i am tempted to go to, who is that full throttle, and buy their 340 set up and install it, but it seems pointless to do so when what i "see" coming out of these boxes are the real wallbro unit, could this be a hoax of some sort, some kinda junk, and if so, hell i don't know, i am just a little ticked right now, thanks for listening and "trying to focus" on what i am after, i really appreciate it.
chris jackson

[Steve Wood]

these days, a big chief tablet would be the best way to communicate with me

unplug the connector at the tank. hook up the fuel pump test connector to the underhood light wire, alternator, or battery.

Now take your meter and go back to the tank.

The tan/white wire should now have battery voltage on it. Check the end coming from the front...not the side of the connector going into the tank

The black wire should be a ground wire.

The third wire should be pink...it's the sender wire...

Just look for 12 volts on the tan/white wire...long as the test lead is connected to a power source under the hood, it should be hot at the back.

You can check the black wire to make sure it is grounded as well.

You may simply have a bad pump

[chris j.]

the sad and ugly truth... i skipped all the bs and took wires straight from a battery and used the tan.white as hot and the black as a ground and nothing, it is dead! i ordered a fuel pump earlier today from mike at full throttle and told him a little of my story... he is curious to hear the numbers on the pump i have... any way, new one on the way, guess i'll see it tomorrow or thursday and see what happens... let you know!
thanks again for patience and input!
chris

[chris j.]

SHE'S ALIVE! thanks steve w. and es i appreciate the patience. the pump was trash. new one from fullthrottle.com
mike over there is super, had a pump in less than a day and great info to boot.
also the relay that is in the hot wire kit, it had water in it, guess the weather pac seal didn't do such a good job.

[Steve Wood]

water does not help...I used to always put a thin smear of rtv around the seam as insurance.

[raregn]

How's the wiring? Was the pump hard to unplug?
I had a '96 Chevy truck at the dealer where I work about 4 years ago that was eating fuel pumps, 6 pumps and 2 senders in 8 months.
In the end we tore the hole truck apart as per GM and replaced the entire wiring harness from front to back. Since then no more pump problems.

[chris j.]

it unplugged pretty easy. i had already changed the wiring from in the tank to the pigtail. i would really hate to have to something like that.
i can say i took that relay apart and it was just filthy and it actually looed as though it was submerged, no it has never been under water!
anyway guess we'll see. as far as changing the whole harness, if i have to deal with this again in the near future i may just set it on fire and start over!

[Steve Wood]

Harness...especially if hot wired...is probably not the problem.

Be sure you clean the tank out to get any sediment out...then change filter just for practice, if nothing else.

[Steve Wood]

also...a suggestion, after you remount the tank...crank it up, set your meter on volts, and put one probe on the tank and one probe on the body sheetmetal...notice I said sheetmetal and not frame....and read the voltage...if it is more than half a volt, you have a grounding problem.