Warning: Timing chain, timing chain tensioner, timing cover, cam button

*JOKER* · 04-17-2002, 09:38 AM

Bad, bad, bad. Purchased a timing chain tensioner from an other than dealership source. It fit well, but when I went to replace the timing cover, the cover cracked due to the tensioner's bolt projecting out too far.

Do not purchase timing chain tensioner from any other source than GM!

If you do, make sure to measure the original bolt projection from the block and remeasure the replacement once in place. IMO, it's worth the $2.99 price difference and the 2 day wait for the GM part. @*& DAMMIT!

*JOKER* · 04-17-2002, 09:49 AM

I plan on ordering a new timing cover from GM. What else will I need to make the job complete? Thanks.

Steve Wood · 04-17-2002, 10:34 AM

a gasket and Zap

*JOKER* · 04-17-2002, 10:38 AM

Just bolt the old oil pump up to the new cover?

*JOKER* · 04-17-2002, 02:41 PM

Steve Wood · 04-17-2002, 03:22 PM

What else you gonna bolt it to?

*JOKER* · 04-17-2002, 04:48 PM

Okay...I see how this is going.

When the new cover comes in, will I:

1. Need any unforseen little gaskets or gizmos?

B. Take any extra steps such as rebuild my pump, etc.

I know I need a new tensioner, timing cover and gasket set. I've never replaced an old TR timing cover with a new TR timing cover before, so I'm trying to plan it right. I've serached tb.com, tbs.com and gnttype.com and haven't come accross anything with details on swaps. Any suggestions would be appreciated.

salvageV6 · 04-17-2002, 05:22 PM

I think there are covers out there that come prebuilt with oil pumps installed. Maybe Ramchargers.

That would be one way to go get one already set for tolerances and high flow.

Steve Wood · 04-17-2002, 05:39 PM

okay, okay

there is the gasket between the oil pump cover and the housing....assume you know about the gasket on the timing cover itself.

You should examine the oil pump gears and see if they appear worn or chipped and replace as required. I would be tempted to replace anyway.

if you read thru this thread, you might find some useful info.

The clearance between the cover and the end of the gears needs to be checked...probably discussed in the below thread. If not, we can go over it... take your old one apart and see what is what...

http://www.turbobuicks.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/002001.html

Nick Micale · 04-17-2002, 10:38 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by *JOKER*:
Bad, bad, bad. Purchased a timing chain tensioner from an other than dealership source. It fit well, but when I went to replace the timing cover, the cover cracked due to the tensioner's bolt projecting out too far. .......

Something is very wrong here. I have used LOTS of aftermarket tensioners and find NO physical difference with the GM one?

Also, none of these, including GM, come with a bolt, re-use the original one.

Must have been a different problem that cracked your cover, wrong tensioner? I have had a counter person try to sell me the wrong one a few times.

------------------
Nick Micale
3334 W. Marconi Ave
Phoenix, AZ 85053
602-866-9908
arizonagn@earthlink.net

Carolinaturbot6 · 04-18-2002, 07:05 AM

Too bad I didn't see this post earlier Ray. My modem went & caught a cold & didn't work for 4 days. I have a cam button I bought from ATR about a year ago that never got used. If you need it, you can have it bud. Talk to ya soon.

*JOKER* · 04-18-2002, 07:49 AM

I appreciate the offer on the cam button Joey, but I've already got it. Thanks,though.

Nick, I may have received the wrong tensioner, but the design was like the OEM one: The bolts diameter and thread count allowed it to go in, the spring lined up with the hole in the block and the tensioner fit perfectly against the chain. The head of the bolt stuck out too far, however, when it was cinched down (and it was in all the way). This is evidenced by the divit and crack in the corresponding area on the timing cover.

It's good to know (now) that the bolt does not get replaced. I only wish that one of the TR web sites had it written somewhere, which is why I made this post. I find it hard to believe that nobody's ever run accross this issue and hopefully this post will prevent it in the future.

Buick T · 04-18-2002, 03:14 PM

I guess it has never come up because the bolt does not wear or anything and you just reuse the old one. And like Nick said I didn't get a new bolt with mine just the tensioner and the spring (Genuine GM).
That cover they are talking about with the HP pump and all is like 500 bones.

*JOKER* · 04-18-2002, 09:29 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Buick T:
That cover they are talking about with the HP pump and all is like 500 bones.

Oh contrare. I picked one up from Southeast Performance Turbo for $120. For another $55, he was going to set it up with an HV oil pump. I was really pleased with their customer service, by the way. I decided to order the stock oil pump rebuild kit and go with the 60 lb spring. Between that and the Biggie Oil Filter Kit, I ought to be okay on oil pressure. I also dropped the oil pump plate off to get machined today because it was a little scored. Between mail order and the resurfacing, I won't be able to get into it until Monday (at best). LOL...this was a four hour job.

RED · 04-18-2002, 10:54 PM

i got a tensioner from advance auto parts once and it broke.. it looked like a factory one and it came with a new bolt which fit behind my cover.

now i have a stock one off a motor i bought it probly has a few 100 thousand miles on it but it has to be better than the one from advance cause it hasent broke

i got my cover from the dealer wholesale of course.

and i use a roller button from atr

04-17-2002, 09:38 AM	#1 (permalink)
JOKER Surely you jest Join Date: May 2001 Location: Norfolk, VA Posts: 453	Warning: Timing chain, timing chain tensioner, timing cover, cam button Bad, bad, bad. Purchased a timing chain tensioner from an other than dealership source. It fit well, but when I went to replace the timing cover, the cover cracked due to the tensioner's bolt projecting out too far. Do not purchase timing chain tensioner from any other source than GM! If you do, make sure to measure the original bolt projection from the block and remeasure the replacement once in place. IMO, it's worth the $2.99 price difference and the 2 day wait for the GM part. *@& DAMMIT!** __________________ I know who your daddy. I was there on November 12, 1966 near Clendenin, West Virginia.

04-17-2002, 09:49 AM	#2 (permalink)
JOKER Surely you jest Join Date: May 2001 Location: Norfolk, VA Posts: 453	I plan on ordering a new timing cover from GM. What else will I need to make the job complete? Thanks. __________________ I know who your daddy. I was there on November 12, 1966 near Clendenin, West Virginia.

04-17-2002, 10:34 AM	#3 (permalink)
Steve Wood An American American Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: East of Eden, Texas Posts: 36,449	a gasket and Zap __________________ ------------------ 'A government that is big enough to give you everything you want, is also big enough to take away everything you have.' - Thomas Jefferson I think one should worry more when people are lining up to get out of a country rather than into it. If they're sneaking in, we must be doing something right. The Chronicles of Zap, from the early 21st century www.vortexbuicks-etc.com

04-17-2002, 10:38 AM	#4 (permalink)
JOKER Surely you jest Join Date: May 2001 Location: Norfolk, VA Posts: 453	Just bolt the old oil pump up to the new cover? __________________ I know who your daddy. I was there on November 12, 1966 near Clendenin, West Virginia.

04-17-2002, 02:41 PM	#5 (permalink)
JOKER Surely you jest Join Date: May 2001 Location: Norfolk, VA Posts: 453	TTT __________________ I know who your daddy. I was there on November 12, 1966 near Clendenin, West Virginia.

04-17-2002, 03:22 PM	#6 (permalink)
Steve Wood An American American Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: East of Eden, Texas Posts: 36,449	What else you gonna bolt it to? __________________ ------------------ 'A government that is big enough to give you everything you want, is also big enough to take away everything you have.' - Thomas Jefferson I think one should worry more when people are lining up to get out of a country rather than into it. If they're sneaking in, we must be doing something right. The Chronicles of Zap, from the early 21st century www.vortexbuicks-etc.com

04-17-2002, 04:48 PM	#7 (permalink)
JOKER Surely you jest Join Date: May 2001 Location: Norfolk, VA Posts: 453	Okay...I see how this is going. When the new cover comes in, will I: 1. Need any unforseen little gaskets or gizmos? B. Take any extra steps such as rebuild my pump, etc. I know I need a new tensioner, timing cover and gasket set. I've never replaced an old TR timing cover with a new TR timing cover before, so I'm trying to plan it right. I've serached tb.com, tbs.com and gnttype.com and haven't come accross anything with details on swaps. Any suggestions would be appreciated. __________________ I know who your daddy. I was there on November 12, 1966 near Clendenin, West Virginia.

04-17-2002, 05:22 PM	#8 (permalink)
salvageV6 Registered User Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: Connecticut, USA Posts: 6,368	I think there are covers out there that come prebuilt with oil pumps installed. Maybe Ramchargers. That would be one way to go get one already set for tolerances and high flow. __________________ WE4, 155K, Daily Driver, DBLBBGT70, 55lb.Inj., Pedophile DP, hollow cat.,Schertz Hi-Pro and 3200Protorque, Postons Headers, 2 1/2"SS Ultraflows and pipes, Ex.Ext. alky chip, EGT/Bilsteins, Boxed Cont. arms/Airbags/snubber,Blizzak snows, Nittos 275/60DR, 307, adj.reg./ SMC alky dual, 9 gauges,scamaster and D.Scan,BSTC, translator and 31/2"MAF, V4 inter. DYNO. TESTED!!! 11.93 @ 113.7 GN loaded, car #2. 115K miles. Accufab reg.,Scanmaster, Reds 100 chip, Mease downpipe, Mease 15row stretch IC, hollow cat., ATR ss. 3"crossflow, SMC alky., J.J. 62mm.T.B., RJC power plate, Bilsteins, Moog springs, HR Parts mount and rear arms, Nittos. "Some Cars Like Lots Of Fuel Pressure and Some Cars Are On Blocks." 12.4 @ 111

04-17-2002, 05:39 PM	#9 (permalink)
Steve Wood An American American Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: East of Eden, Texas Posts: 36,449	okay, okay there is the gasket between the oil pump cover and the housing....assume you know about the gasket on the timing cover itself. You should examine the oil pump gears and see if they appear worn or chipped and replace as required. I would be tempted to replace anyway. if you read thru this thread, you might find some useful info. The clearance between the cover and the end of the gears needs to be checked...probably discussed in the below thread. If not, we can go over it... take your old one apart and see what is what... http://www.turbobuicks.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/002001.html __________________ ------------------ 'A government that is big enough to give you everything you want, is also big enough to take away everything you have.' - Thomas Jefferson I think one should worry more when people are lining up to get out of a country rather than into it. If they're sneaking in, we must be doing something right. The Chronicles of Zap, from the early 21st century www.vortexbuicks-etc.com

04-18-2002, 07:05 AM	#11 (permalink)
Carolinaturbot6 Member Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Summerville,S.C.,USA Posts: 349	Too bad I didn't see this post earlier Ray. My modem went & caught a cold & didn't work for 4 days. I have a cam button I bought from ATR about a year ago that never got used. If you need it, you can have it bud. Talk to ya soon. __________________ 87 GN....038 w/st. mains 10/10 crank.. Wiseco pistons 206/206 roller Champ. irons TE44/Houston dp Janis tranny w/ 9/11 convertor

04-18-2002, 07:49 AM	#12 (permalink)
JOKER Surely you jest Join Date: May 2001 Location: Norfolk, VA Posts: 453	I appreciate the offer on the cam button Joey, but I've already got it. Thanks,though. Nick, I may have received the wrong tensioner, but the design was like the OEM one: The bolts diameter and thread count allowed it to go in, the spring lined up with the hole in the block and the tensioner fit perfectly against the chain. The head of the bolt stuck out too far, however, when it was cinched down (and it was in all the way). This is evidenced by the divit and crack in the corresponding area on the timing cover. It's good to know (now) that the bolt does not get replaced. I only wish that one of the TR web sites had it written somewhere, which is why I made this post. I find it hard to believe that nobody's ever run accross this issue and hopefully this post will prevent it in the future. __________________ I know who your daddy. I was there on November 12, 1966 near Clendenin, West Virginia.

04-18-2002, 03:14 PM	#13 (permalink)
Buick T Member Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Memphis, TN Posts: 221	I guess it has never come up because the bolt does not wear or anything and you just reuse the old one. And like Nick said I didn't get a new bolt with mine just the tensioner and the spring (Genuine GM). That cover they are talking about with the HP pump and all is like 500 bones. __________________ 1 owner T commin back to life. Bone azz stock - right now !

04-18-2002, 10:54 PM	#15 (permalink)
RED Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: newport news va. Posts: 54	i got a tensioner from advance auto parts once and it broke.. it looked like a factory one and it came with a new bolt which fit behind my cover. now i have a stock one off a motor i bought it probly has a few 100 thousand miles on it but it has to be better than the one from advance cause it hasent broke i got my cover from the dealer wholesale of course. and i use a roller button from atr __________________ 85 ttype going under the knife soon for 87 transplant but wont be giving up on the hotair set up it will be in another car. so far hot air been 1309@103.7 with many stock parst still intact including stock 85 ecm and chip,stock turbo self ported,stock ex. headers port matched,stock injectors in need of replacement,self modded intake,home brewed port work on stock heads,stock valves never had a valve job with 183,*** on the clock,sealed power replacement cam,atr 21/2 downpipe,stock up pipe,stock fuel pump NOT hotwired,kb billet reg,and the best thing ive done to it yet is..........wrapped fuel rail with headder wrap that made a big inprovment in restarting and drivability.ok enough said

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